Sunday, May 15, 2016

MOP Breaks Down Outlander Season 2 Ep 6: Best Laid Schemes

57 comments:

  1. Love your recap. Per your question about returning to France: They return to Paris briefly in Voyager.

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  2. Hi ladies! Thank you for your recap! You are both gorgeous and sooo funny.

    I am "eh" about the series this season. So many great parts (casting, costumes, etc.) but just not adding up to something that has the emotional impact of the books. I think I'm only enjoying it to the extent that I am (which is not a whole lot) because I HAVE read the books.

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  3. Couple notes about the "smallpox" plot. In the book there was this whole convoluted plot where Murtaugh would travel to wherever the wine shipment was coming from, get on that ship, take the herbs & fake being sick, and the captain would panic and go to the nearest port and offload the wine so it would not be a total loss - somehow Jamie would meet up with the ship and buy all the wine (therefore the wine would not make it to Paris). It always made me sooo uncomfortable because of so many things that could go wrong!

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  4. ****SPOILER ALERT******
    Thoughts on Fergus: given the set up (Fergus stealing) I wonder if they are moving the hand scene up from Voyager...? Perhaps Fergus will get his hook earlier? It would make sense and help them get away from the sexual assaults. Although.... Fergus did give Jamie the whole "I'm no whore!" line, could that be foreshadowing for next week? Will he be raped anyway? I agree that TV BJR doesn't seem like a pedophile. If they have to revisit BJR to play out the Mary/ Alex story line, is it too much for BJR to rape Fergus as he does in the books? I don't know if viewers, particularly non- books readers, would be turned off. I don't feel like Fergus will walk away with a beating though. Don't know if that would be enough to set Jamie off... or would it?
    DW

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    1. I think Black Jack will brand Fergus with his ring as a mark of a thief. That will give a nod to the book as Claire finding the mark on Fergus leads to him telling her what happens at the brothel.

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  5. Wasn't the little bottle supposed to be lavendar oil??? I thought that was the way the writers were telling us it was Black Jack because he used that oil on Jamie. And we all know some of the things he used that oil for so it was natural to assume that it was coming with Fergus.

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  6. Just watched your video. Good job. This was an emotional and anxiety filled episode. Being a book reader I knew what was coming. I just re-read the scene where Fergus tells Claire what happened. It's after quite a while...a few months when she sees the brand and he breaks down and tells her why Jamie broke his oath not to duel. The fact that all that time Fergus blamed himself was so very heart breaking. I know if they stay true to the book I'll be in tears - sobs even. I wouldn't think we'll see this until a couple episodes pass.

    taz

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  7. Hey ladies,
    Loved your comments this week
    most of my thoughts were brought out above, save two.
    1. Highlander hubby super engrossed in this ep. He somehow didn't clue in that this baby was not the baby that went through the stones until this ep. maybe that's why the baby bump issues. I know that who I thought Brianna was when I read the book, but We didn't see Claire return. Hubby mostly happy with fight scene, but still wanted Jamie to cut off BJRs head.
    2. #TTWH None of these events would have happened if Claire didn't go through the stones because Jamie, Murtagh and likely the whole MacKenzie clan would have been killed in the ambush by the Roostertail mountains in Ep. 1. Just some butterfly wings to hit you with...

    Thanks again,
    Therese in New Scotland

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  8. Claire DID know that she was bleeding badly, and even knew her own life was in danger, when she was rushing to the woods and watching the fight.

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  9. The bottle that Fergus picked up is lavender perfume he wants to take back to Claire. How is that for completing the circle?

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  10. The bottle that Fergus picked up is lavender perfume he wants to take back to Claire. How is that for completing the circle?

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  11. SPOILER





    With BJR and Fergus, it was a "transaction".

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    1. Technically that's true. The Madame told him to go with Randall and she would split the money with him. He'd done it before and he thought it'd be over before Jamie noticed he was gone. But Fergus is 10! BJR did not discriminate with the rape. How does someone end up like that?

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  12. Ladies, I think we're out of France after Ep 7 Faith. Ep 8 is called The Fox's Lair -that refers to the Master of Lovat right (who is in Scotland)? But that means Ep 7 is going to be a whirlwind and a major tearjerker. I don't mind, I want to cry...

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  13. I worried how they were going to make this book for TV as there are so many scenes and characters. Last year we had the rural/castle backdrop and everyone was wearing wool and neck cowls. This year they are in Paris with Foo-Foo gowns and brocaded vests and parties at the Versailles with the King. This week's episode includes many scenes that I thought would be missed but instead were written in and compiled. It felt crammed with assorted scenes. However remember there are fewer episodes than last year. I believe there is more dialogue with Fergus because he eats up the camera, he is so adorable. I've read they are planning now for Voyager but are just waiting for the go-ahead from Starz. After I read each book I couldn't imagine how the next could top the one I finished. Well it does. This is a love story about Claire and Jamie and they evolve and move forth and every book is great. The series can't get boring because of Jamie and Claire, plus more rich characters. I can't get my husband to watch the show this year yet, he wants the fights and battles. I told him to sit tight as they'll be back in Scotland again.

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  14. I had to pause the vid to comment on "Deep Outlander Thoughts"!!!! LOLLLLLL!!!! "Did her parents feign death to get away from her...?" <33333333. HILARIOUS!!

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  15. I certainly wasn't bored or pissed off by this episode [unlike earlier eps] - it was well paced and a lot happened. The funny bits were well done and we're going to need them. I think that in terms of "going there" re: BJR's fresh hell, they have to - and well, they DID use the song Dear God in the promos for good reason. I just hope they don't get graphic - that may be a line Tobias won't cross... We'll see. Like you, I can't wait for this show to get out of France.

    I was puzzled by the long scene with Claire's "friends" - I felt it was superfluous, we KNOW Claire doesn't like them much and isn't like them at all.

    I wanted MORE Jaime and Fergus at breakfast. I disagree with you that that scene went on too long - it wasn't long enough. I know that these stories are dense but the books are SO extraordinary because DG writes such wonderful conversation. The interactions don't always further the plot, but they deepen the characters, often surprising and delighting [or slaying] readers with some unexpected insight into someone or an idea. The everyday interactions are as special and as important as the rip-roarin' adventure and drama, at least to this book reader. This should be a long running show, encompassing all the books and maybe even some of the novellas, so including some of DG's very best work on those levels is vital. They are going to have to in order to do justice to LJG, Willoughby [and yes, he IS important and interesting and funny], Ian, Roger and Bree, among others. Sure, we got "I'll guard your right" and I thought the same thing Carol did, but a bit more joyful bonding in a quiet way is welcome any time.

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  16. Me again... Also, i agree that the executioner scene was really long for no apparent reason.
    SPOILER ALERT (sort of) It would've been time better spent if he'd talked about the ins and outs of hangings and ropes, etc.... like he did in the book. And Claire remembered that conversation in a later book.

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  17. Just a few quick observations: NON-BOOK READERS BEWARE - SPOILAGE AHEAD!

    In the book there was a transaction between Fergus and BJR BUT Fergus took one look at BJR in his altogether and tried to back out because he knew he couldn't handle him. So, in the end, it was indeed forced - it was his screams that attracted Jamie's attention.

    One thing that the series is missing from the book is how the tables turned at Wentworth and the impact on BJR. BJR came out of there with a somewhat pathetic obsession with Jamie that is not being portrayed in the TV series. BJR knew that Fergus was under Jamie's protection and he purposely used him to provoke Jamie to a duel.

    I'm with Tom. I was hopping the series would handle some things differently and allow me to like her. Sadly they are staying with the book. DIA ruined me for Claire. I was never able to forgive her for making Jamie promise not to kill BJR when he had the chance, for manipulating Mary and Alex, and for blaming Jamie for the death of their child when it was her decision to run to the duel. From that point on all I could see was one selfish inconsiderate escapade after another that put Jamie and others in danger. By Book 8 I was getting irritated with Jamie for putting up with it. If it weren't for Jamie and several other WONDERFUL characters I would have stopped reading after Voyager.

    In the series the executioner described drawn and quartering to Jamie as a way to subtly warn him to take care with his political dealings. In the series they have re-purposed that rather cleverly, I think, to set up Claire's involvement in the Star Chamber. Lots of things are going to have to get compressed in the next episode or two. I'm hoping that the Claire - King Louis interaction is skipped because I thought that was a bit much after such a major miscarriage.

    Promises

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    1. I feel the same about Claire. I read the books because of Jamie.

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    2. I have always felt I was alone in my feelings about Claire from DIA onwards. This is because of the many Outlander sites I would go to, everyone would go to great lengths to NEVER criticize Ms. Gabaldon. I have read all the books multiple times since watching the tv series, and enjoy them overall, but in real life, Jamie would have put up with Claire for about a year or two max ( even in the 21st century). I do believe that their relationship equalizes over the course of the series, you just have to keep at it! I had hoped that the tv series would have softened some of Claire's edges, even if some diehard book readers got upset. Remember the non-book viewers ( like Tom)!!!

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    3. I agree that Claire's behavior is annoying in the books, but Jamie loves her and I love Jamie so I continued to read. I wonder if Ron & Co. are trying to make Jamie a more modern man...I miss the kind but always macho, warrior Jamie. However, with the healing of wounds by BJR, maybe he will be tougher and sexier in the future episodes. I worry about the King Louis scene: they seem to have made him more likeable, so I dread a sexier scene than the book. We'll know soon!

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  18. IMHO, this episode is a hot mess. Yes, Tracey, there’s a missing scene. I so needed it at the end of last week’s episode, but just assumed they wanted to end on a moment of high tension. In the book, Jamie tells Claire to go to bed (after smashing his hand through a window) while he sits up all night thinking about having to wait to kill BJR, but yes, there is a dawn reconciliation scene between them that, while short, just feels like a giant, gaping hole here in the series. Since both episodes 205 and 206 run short, I don’t understand why it wasn’t included.

    Carol, I also hated the Forez scene. It went on FAR too long! The scene was not used the same way in the book, where it was a warning to Jamie about the penalty in England for high treason, a crime for which one would have been drawn and quartered. Since heretics in France would still have been burned during this time, it was a mostly pointless and inaccurate conversation (someone should have fact checked with DG). I am only supposing they are using it here so we won’t be too confused about the pseudo trial / King Louis situation. I liked Master Raymond getting a heads up, but hated how much the scene felt like déjà vu (back to Cranesmuir!), and how much time it ate up. I wonder if the goriness was used here to appeal to male interest.

    Wasn’t this “steal the wine” scheme even MORE convoluted – and dangerous – than the plan in the book? All of the running around we had to watch them do in this episode wasted time – time that should be treated as precious. We need more Scotland!!

    That odd scene at Louise’s seemed out of left field. I’d have much rather seen more conversation between Claire and Jamie, or even Claire and Murtagh. I still need more of the small moments that add so much to the relationships and character development, and not the harried rush to tag convoluted plot points. And don’t even get me started on the “You could lie to me” line. Do you think they are just purposely baiting book fans?

    After this episode, it’s only my love of the book characters that will keep me hanging on. I thought that the dilution of Jamie’s character was annoying enough, but the changes to Claire’s character this season have proven to be even worse. This week, my winner for MOST ANNOYING MOMENT is when we see her rushing to the scene of a duel where her soul mate is fighting (with a weakened hand), and he could possibly be imprisoned for life, or even DIE, but we are only shown her worrying over her gold wedding ring from Frank! What? No wonder there’s Clair bashing.

    I will defend book Claire. I never thought her request to Jamie to delay killing BJR was unreasonable - difficult, yes, but not unreasonable. A blood lust for vengeance is a blinding emotion, and Jamie needed time to gain control. He would later prove to be a better man and be able to rise above his initial need to kill. Also, in the book, Claire does NOT interfere with Mary and Alex. Alex simply leaves France after the duke dismisses him. As for the blame Claire places on Jamie for the baby’s death, it is meant as a purposeful and desperate deterrent to keep Jamie from coming close enough to pull her out of the numbing depression she has cocooned herself in. It is an unreasonable reaction to both grief and guilt over losing her baby. She knows Jamie can bring her out of her darkness, but she is afraid to leave it, and is especially afraid to face feelings and life once again.

    Dolittle

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    1. Once again, Dolittle says exactly what I am thinking and expresses it so much better than I can!

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    2. Dolittle, I agree with "anonymous" that your comments are in line with what I'm thinking also. I wonder who is making the ultimate decision to portray Jamie and Claire in the way they've been done in the show. I just don't understand why they don't at least try to capture these two beloved characters more like the books. It baffles me. Thanks to Tracy and Carol for their great videos and Dolittle thanks for your insightful comments.

      taz

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    3. Spot on Dolittle. Agree 100%

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  19. Great video, gals. I need to take notes so I can remember what to comment on. SPOILAGE ALERT: I have a concern: book King Louis is wimpy and rather repulsive, but TV Louis is cute and funny. How are they going to film the Starchamber scene? Will Claire's reaction be like the book and how does she explain this to Jamie?

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  21. Okay... PLEASE everyone, stop referring to "spoilers" and "spoiler alerts." Who in this world is going to be so worried about it? And if they are so worried about spoilers, would they be reading everything there is to read about Outlander, and watching video recaps about Outlander? It's an obsession, people, just say what you want to say! Okay, I got that off my chest. Keep on with the entertaining recaps, Carol and Tracy.

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    1. Susan B, I agree with you.

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    2. Me too. Who would be following that hasn't read the books and can't handle a spoiler or two?

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  22. Hi Ladies- great recaps as always! Tracey's question about rich people breakfasts made me think of a movie recommendation. The answer to her question is covered in Gosford Park - great movie written by Julien Fellowes (Downton writer). Someone points out to the "ugly American" character that proper Englishmen do not expect to be waited on at breakfast when he tried to place an order with the Carson-like butler. Oh well - back to Outlander. Thank you for some Monday giggles :-)

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  23. I'll be glad when they are out of Paris. I looked back in the book on how the scene was handled with Fergus and BJR. Different and with Fergus' explanation to Claire.
    Carol, I agree, at least 1/3 of their Men audience probably won't stick with this, as does most audiences who won't invest themselves is a serialized TV drama versus one that is episodic. They won't too lose much of their book audience, but how many like me got bored with the books and starting skimming? Can't do that with TV show. If people haven't read the books, they don't know when Paris ends. I notice they haven't said anything about ratings since the premiere, and no renewal. Can the book audience support this price of a production? They'll need several platforms of viewership rather than just premium TV/Computer/mobile option to bring in eyeballs. Luckily they don't need to worry about ad support, but Outlander also doesn't lend itself to product placement - so production is based on licensing - difficult. Sony must strive for channels/networks in their countries, but they now have a new crop of TV shows as of this week to sell internationally.
    Fully explains why "Paris" was shot in value-priced Prague/Scotland studios. They must get back to Scotland - when I looked at DIA - Paris was a fair amount, but still leaves a large portion of the book back in Scotland.

    Love your commentaries - I really do appreciate the opinions and views of T&C & the people participating in comments - so interesting! They are my Sunday morning fix with my coffee, except when they are Sunday evening! I think my thing is Tweeting as you can be in the moment - only the # needs to be a little shorter if possible?????
    One side note - the anger when I felt in showing the redcoat jacket and Fergus stealing. I skimmed that in the book so didn't read it, but knew exactly what was coming and it was confirmed when I went back to the book...If you've read the books, you know when time stops for BJR, and for me, it's unfortunate it isn't sooner...jefsantamonica

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    1. SO funny...I started reading this and thought, "Wow. This person is really informed on the production/marketing end of it...sounds like JEF. Then I got to the end and saw your name! :) PS - Think they should put out a trailer that shows that they will head back to Scotland mid-season?

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    2. OH yeah,we need many "coming soon in Outlander..." and make me WRONG that if there is a season 3 it doesn't start till Aug/Sept 2017 if they can get 13 eps. jefsantamonica

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  24. Love Love Love Deep Outlander Thoughts With Tom! Hilarous and a great addition to your podcast! You have become a part of the Outlander Series experience for me - I watch it right after the episode (or Sunday morning . . .) I wish they'd get out of Paris already. There is so much that happens when they get back to Scotland. How will they fit it all in. Like the prior comment, I too skimmed over this part of the book it made me so sick about BJR molesting little Fergus. It was awful. I hope series Claire is able to reconcile Jamie's reasoning to duel him. Probably not, though, with the series Claire we have been given this season. Also, when will we finally hear about VOYAGER! One of my favorites. DIA wasn't a favorite of mine. :-( LOVE your recaps! Want to adopt you both as sisters. LOL You have way too much fun. Have a great week!

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    1. Awww thanks Jen!! We would love to be adopted by you; Third Sister Jill never made it past Outlander!! LOL! She is going to watch Season 2 though...she's waiting for it to be available at the library. (insert eye-rolling emoji here) ;) We'll "see" you next week!!

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  25. I wonder if Claire's changing belly size was their way of telling the audience that time has passed since their argument from the last episode.

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  26. I love you guys, I can't wait for your post each week. Thank you for your Outlander thoughts, you are both hilarious I love to laugh with you each week. Hope you have a wonderful week. Cherri from Texas.

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    1. You are MORE than welcome, Cherri. That's exactly why we do it and I appreciate the positive feedback!!! :)

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  27. Another fantastic recap! I love the Show but I honestly can't wait to get back to Scotland...I felt the same way each of the three times I read DIA. With that said, bravo to Ron Moore and all associated with the Show. It is fantastic and the cast is killing it...Sam Heughan is breaking my heart like only JAMMF can and Caitriona Balfe is equally amazing. I always had an idea of what Jamie and Claire would be like but these actors have brought them into focus for me. They are just fantastic and will only shine more in the coming episodes...Starz should have Kleenex sponsor S2!

    You gals are fantastic! Thank you for all of your hard work and thank you for "Deep Outlander Thoughts...with Tom" - I am still laughing!

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  28. OMgosh! ENOUGH spoilers!!!! Some of us haven't read the book!
    That being said, ENJOY Tracey & Carol very much. I know that, if I have questions or am unclear about an episode that they will cover it well by Sunday or Monday. I am not enjoying this season as much as last; just don't care for the venue much, Paris. Most of the characters are so pretentious and totally useless in their daily living. I wonder how Murtaugh can tolerate this nonsense at all!
    Keep entertaining and educating us Tracey & Carol. Just folks, PLEASE remember some of us are non-book readers: the SPOILERS are, well SPOILING it for us! Thanks guys.

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  29. Fergus's Twitter @romannberrux

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  30. Fergus's Twitter @romannberrux

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  31. LOVE LOVE LOVE the Tom Deep Thoughts.... those are gold. He had me laughing out loud! Z

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  32. Thanks for another great recap and the TOM moment!! Very funny. So, did anyone else think it was super hot when Jamie and the Comte came face to face ready to duke it out! Whew! I guess this would be equivalent to men watching women wrestling! I'm a book reader but the show brings me back for more of the fantastic cast, etc.

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  33. To spoil or not to spoil...it really is hard to discuss or ask a question without letting something slip. I've read a lot of books and book series that eventually make it to t.v or movies, and sometimes you hardly recognized the story were it not for the character names. Although I have an ongoing struggle with the development of beloved characters and my perception vs the reality of production's, Outlander has actually done a good job of staying close to the book's basic outline. I did wonder if there was a set up in this past episode to begin a pretty major deviation from the story...so SPOILER ALERT to whom it may concern.
    I can't help but wonder if Murtagh's story line will change. (which I would have no problem with at all!!) His interaction with Claire has taken a different tone than the book and he has become a necessary "back to Scotland conscience" for Jamie. Doesn't it feel like Murtagh/Duncan Lacroix has become that warm and fuzzy godfather that no one wants to see leave?


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    1. *******SOMEWHAT SPOILED REPLY****** :-)

      I would also love to see a change in Murtagh’s story line. We should campaign for it. I can just envision t-shirts, button pins, and painted water tower signs with the name FERRIS crossed out so that they could read “SAVE MURTAGH.”

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    2. SPOILAGE CONTINUES....
      I adore Murtagh, but he can't stay:( Jamie would be a different person if Murtagh survives, no? The circumstances that Jamie has to cope with post-Culloden, that shape the man he ultimately becomes, that all depends on his world being completely devastated. And what better way to do that than to take Claire and Murtagh from him? It's cruel, I know.

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    3. UGH Anon. You are probably right. I just suck at facing it. Always have. I've never been comfortable with the amount of knowledge we got - or didn't get - about the end of Murtagh's life. I have so many questions.

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    4. Dolittle - that Save Ferris (crossed out) thing has me in hysterics. I'd do it. I totally would. ;)

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  34. I agree with you gals that the actor playing BPC is terrific! SPOILER*** in the book there is a scene in which Claire watches BPC visit the men wounded in battle and she is impressed with his behavior toward the men and can see that he might have made a good king after all ... I really really hope that scene makes it to the show. After all there had to be a reason the Highlanders fought so long and hard for him and for all the folklore that came down in song, etc about him. He had to have had some appeal other than wanting to put a Catholic back on the throne.

    I'm glad you guys are liking that actor now...as I do too. Mark me! I think he deserves an Emmy.

    Oh! and Carol, I've started watching Rome because of your comments about Tobias last year. And I am enjoying it ... also in one of the scenes I saw this week one of the characters says, "Mark me!" Yeah! lol!

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  35. in the book Murtaugh goes to Portugal to wait for Jamie, who ends up in the Bastile. Claire loses the baby and goes to Fountaine bluea with Lousie. Claire then gets the message meant for Jamie that the wine deal is a go, but where is he? Now she finds out he is in the Bastile and she goes to the king.

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  36. Loved Tom's Deep Outlander Thoughts!! Hilarious! When watching the scene of Claire with the French ladies, I was thinking "what the hell??" and I was uncomfortable with the scene, for lack of a better word. But thinking it over, I think we were SUPPOSED to be uncomfortable, because Claire was. Also, she had to be doing something while the men were off having their wine heist caper. Many kudos to Sam, Cait, Duncan, & Romann (Fergus).

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  37. This had to be the best show of the season and without a doubt Cat's best performance to date and I think she's pretty good all around. I can't hint at Emmy award because I can't be crushed again when she won't be nominated.
    We lost a twin son 36 years ago from SIDS and watching Cat play this role was the best enactment of a loss of child I have ever seen. I was so pulled apart yet so grateful that this was performed as close to the reality of emotion I have ever seen. These feelings don't go away, we sort of put them on a shelf, but they creep back every so often. I appreciate that this episode gave credence to this subject the same as they wanted to address PTSD.
    When Jamie said he had " ..something to do first" I said out loud "Yeah shave off that beard first."
    I was shocked with Fergus's rape, but hey after last year I felt this is the line we crossed. I agree they could have done this more modified, I don't think they give the audience the benefit to realize what has happened.
    This bothers me.... when Bree asks Claire if she ever saw a Heron bird Claire tells her yes in Scotland. Call me a stickler but she saw it in France. And where did the placenta go? Raymond left it in the bed for no one looking for it.
    I cringed when Jamie left the heirloom spoon on the grave. Come on someone will steal the spoon, dahhhh.
    I love love love the recap shows, look forward to them every week.

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