Carol Blogs. Tracey Tweets. James Alexander Malcolm Mackenzie Fraser means to take his time about it, aye?
Hey y'all..love the review so far. I had to stop it and weigh in on Jenny. This one character they have kept true to the books! (SPOILER ALERT) Later in the books, Jenny admits to wanting to get rid of Claire because she knew Jamie would have to go away. She was a total bitch and helped to send Claire on her way after bringing "Damn her eyes" to the home to destroy Jamie and Claire's reunion. She IS selfish and admits it. I think Carol remembers this better than she thinks!
THANKS JULIA!!! Dangit, I knew it!! I second guess myself way too much in these videos. Jenny is a selfish and immature little girl in a woman's body. It's always HER way or the highway. I don't take away from her the fact that she runs the place and does a damn good job of it. But geez, woman...ease UP and let people EXPLAIN! You owe them THAT MUCH out of common decency! These aren't traveling salesmen; they're your FAMILY!!! There was definitely a resentment toward Claire because Jamie LOVED HER and Jenny wasn't in charge anymore. Oooh, oooh, oooh...I have to go find Voyager and read s'more. THANKS! :)
All I can say is Jenny is savage in the episode...Claire doesn't need sunblock ever again since Jenny is casting so much shade...
ROFLMAO this made me laugh at 6:10 this AM when I was barely awake enough to hold my coffee. 😂
Now that I have finished the review, I will say that this was one of the better episodes this season, but that is not saying much.There have been so many character adjustments this season that it don't recognize some of them. Frank was not at all the same and I think his character arc shows that when you change a major character, it changes the storyI have seen reviews by non book readers who thought that not only was Jamie's response to news of his daughter was "muted", but felt the same about Fergus' response to seeing Claire. To a certain degree this season, more than the 1st 2 seasons has just used the story as a general outline and sometimes feel that I too only watch out of loyalty.But I keeping hoping to see the story and they keep messing it up. I don't expect everything to presented just the same as in the books,but changing Jamie into a guy that wasn't brought to tears when he discovered the biggest sacrifice of his life wasn't for nothing because his daughter survived or as a guy who seems to consider his second wife a bigger secrect, and therefore more important than Willie changes everthing.This story is around the characters. When you change them, the story doesn't work. I think it was Tracy that pointed out that Ian was being treated like a 14 yr old but presented as 16 and that makes the storyline not work When Geneva threatened Jamies's in the show, with no mention of the letters smuggled to Lollybroch,I wondered how they would deal with this later in the show. In the books, Ian and Jenny knew about the treasure and both Young Jamie and Matthew had swam to the island. Without this info, it doesn't seem reasonable that Ian's parents would let him go.
Good recap/review ladies! I did not like Jenny in the books and really, really dislike her in the show. She is selfish and controlling. She did call Claire a stray! Remember she called Claire a bad name when she met her back in season one. She does take Jamie's money. Look at the way they live...even have servants. She is a *itch with a capital B! Actress does a wonderful job portraying Jenny.In the books I think that Claire was also "wanted" by the English as Red Jamie's wife. (Didn't they find wanted posters for both Red Jamie and his wife?)So she could have been tried and executed for treason as an English citizen helping the Scotts. It would have made sense for her not to have contacted (written) to them as it would have put them in danger. Remember the English for years kept coming back to Lallybrook still looking for Jamie. So that would have been a good reason for her not to send them any letters.I wish they had shown that the Murray's other boys had gone out to the island for jewels so it would have made more sense they gave permission for young Ian to do it.It bothered me that young Ian was making poop bricks with his ruffled sleeves on...he should have put on working clothes. lol. Just a little detail but it didn't make sense him working like that still dressed in his "good" traveling clothes.I like this episode better than last week but that's not saying much.
I am watching your youtube review and had to pop over here to remind you in the books Leery marries Jamie so she can keep her home which she inherited from her dead husband. Also she continues to remain single (with her farm hand lover) after Jamie leaves with Claire so she can keep her home. There are a couple of references in the book about Jamie's day to day life with her. One is Jamie tells Claire about sitting on the couch with both little girls and teaching them to read. And he tells Claire about one day while he was working in the garden Leery brings him a glass of ale and thanks him for taking such good care of her place. He talks about Leery becoming totally silent for days at a time and about her flinching whenever he wanted to touch her. I think he doesn't find out about Leery being involved in Claire's witch trial until years later when he and Claire were on Frazer's Ridge.
YES! VALIDATION! Thank you!! I knew it!!! There was never any love in that marriage. She might have still had some girlish crush stuff happening but at the end of the day, he was providing for them. She was way too freaked out by her last husband to enjoy sex with Jamie. They had a marriage of convenience that was felt on both sides. THANKS!!
Amen. Still with marriage in 18th century the wife's property became the husband's unless their contract stated otherwise. Jamie mentions to Claire in the tv series he wanted to be a father (mentioned first) and a husband (mentioned second). Yet within months he left them, so fatherhood seems to have been less important to him than he stated. It is difficult to do more than financial support from a distance of 4 day horseback ride. He alludes to the fact that he and Laoghaire shared litte pleasant conversation in or outside their bed. Yet I'm not sure what he should have expected from a person he did NOT LOVE. Of course he probably thought the sex would be ok. So, regardless of his statements to Claire, what really drove him away from his reasons to marry...? My personal take is deep down in his heart of hearts he knew he had betrayed Claire and her memory and comprised his own integrity. Yet I do understand most of us don't want to confront ourselves of our deep failing. However, actions often have long lasting consequences. The earlier we take this into account before we commit an action, the better off we are in the future.
I just re-read the passage from the book and ...Laoghaire's second husband was Simon MacKimmie of clan Fraser. Marsali and Joan are his. "He had a good house and property". Simon died in prison. He left Laoghaire the main house and a little money which Ned Gowan helped her keep away from the English who were seizing property. Ned Gowan told Jenny about the widow Laoghaire and Jenny "at once sent an invitation" for Laoghaire and her girls to come to Lallybroch for Hogmanany. Laoghaire asked him to dance saying "Your sister says your a bonny dancer". Jamie told Claire"...there she was a widow with two bairns. She needed a man...I needed something. I supposed that we might help each other." They married quietly, he moved into her place. He moved out less than a year later.
Spolier, we find out in later book that Jamie used to call Claire's name in his sleep and get off, pardon my language. So that infuriated Leghair and that's why she was cold, not from abuse.
Potential spoiler (depends on how series conforms to books!!!) I would imagine both are factors for Laoghaire. Viewers can read book 4 and book 7 for Laoghaire's side to this. Book 7 will tell you Laoghaire was able to later experience sex with pleasure.
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Geillis sent the ship to get the gem stones and to collect young boys for her nefarious purposes
I've been thinking about Claire's final "maybe we aren't meant to be together" speech at the cliff....In the book, after Ian is kidnapped, Jamie has a sad and goes on about how maybe God won't allow him to have Claire, yada yada yada...Do you think the writer's room moved that around and gave it to Claire? The sentiment is kinda the same...I prefer the book version, but, duh, of course the book version is better....
On the whole I liked this episode much better than last week's. I wasn't surprised that Jenny had the suspicious attitude and spiky remarks toward Claire but I was surprised that she is the one who told Laoghaire about Claire being back. I would have thought that she wouldn't want all the drama and fighting, and that she would still have some loyalty to Claire because of her help with the difficult labor situation years ago. I agree with your comments on Jamie not defending Claire as much as you would expect, and with him digging a deeper hole when talking about not being the girls' father. It's really hard to get my head around believing that Jamie would have married Laoghaire after knowing that she played a part in almost getting Claire killed. The actress who plays Laoghaire is also in the Victoria series. It took a long time for me to warm to her character in Victoria because of what happened in season 1.I liked all the interaction as well with wee Ian and Claire. He really projects sincerity very well. I also enjoyed seeing Ned Gowan again and it made me laugh when Claire sweetly said "you haven't changed a bit!" -- and he's the character who looks like they have aged the most! I really liked Bill Paterson in the mini series called "The Crow Road" It's also set in Scotland and is really good.I can't wait to read Voyager although I'm trying not to read ahead of the series.
I'm with you, Carol. I don't think Laoghaire ever loved Jamie. I think she viewed him as her property since the time that he took the beating for her. I also think there are parallels between she and Frank. They both missed the opportunity to find happiness by spending their lives resenting Jamie and Claire's love. Frank had Claire's heart before Jamie, was by her account a good lover and an intellectual equal. I think if he had focussed more on recapturing some of what made her fall for him, they would have been happier. Likewise, Laoghaire could have been happier with Jamie if she had been kind to him and they could have built a life together sharing in the love for her kids. Ask any divorced or single mom how much love can grow for a man who truly loves her kids and in this case, it's not some boring, homely guy, it's freaking Jamie!I don't want to think for one second that he was ever happy with Laoghaire and I can't say how grateful I am that they did not show a flashback with the two of them in bed. I would still be vomiting if they did that. In short, Laoghaire and Frank both missed an opportunity due at least as much to their own actions and behavior as to Jamie and Claire's eternal connection.
Thank you, ladies, for an interesting video! I think, Carol, that Jamie's comment accusing Claire of leaving him, was just in the show. It IS one of the stages of grief when you get angry at the person who died and accuse him of leaving you. It gives you the chance to let him go. And I'd like to mention this: throughout all the books, when I would get tired of Claire's shrewishness and troublemaking, I'd think of ALL she gave up for Jamie, and she never throws it in his face. She never complains.Also, I think in the book the older Murray boys have all swum (?) out to the island for jewels or money so it's Ian's turn.I did miss the tender fireside scene, when Claire comes back and tends to Jamie by the fire. Doesn't she climb on the cot and sleep with him? That's when he tells her it is so wonderful to be with someone and he doesn't even have to have a name.I enjoyed this episode, even the changes. Jenny is obnoxious and always is. I was really captivated, waiting to see what would happen next. Well done!
No the comment Jamie made was in the book also.
This was a GREAT video! When I read about Leghair in the books, I threw it across the floor. My girlfriend non book reader was watching the episode and threw the remote across the room she was so angry! LOL
😂 I wish I could have seen that. :)
Much better episode this week than the last 2. I thought Tracey would have a problem with Nell Hudson's name in the opening credit spoiling the surprise. Carol, according to the closed caption of Netflix, what Jamie said when they were rolling around was "I love you and only you".
OMG no way!!! 😮❤️ I LOVE THAT!!! That sounds like something he'd have said in the books. That is what I miss most about Book Jamie. He was always whispering sweet nothings in Claire's ear. :::major giggling going on right now in my brain for saying that::: I miss alllllll the little commentary that sprang forth from Jamie's mouth to Claire's ears only...on a daily basis. :)
Why didn't Claire or Jaime tell Jenny about Brianna? Suddenly her story about survival and a new husband would make a lot more sense - and it's the truth. She wouldn't have left Jaime for any other reason.
YEAH...why couldn't they have (sort of) told Jenny the truth? I was PREGNANT and Jamie wanted his child as far away from Scotland as possible! GREAT point!
In my head (Claire's POV never grasped the "other" side, meaning she never perceived what the Lallybroch household went through when she disappeared. Of course what Jenny said made complete sense - ok so you thought Jamie was dead, so why not try to reach someone else ... me (Jenny) Ian, my children. Because Jamie is 'dead' does not necessarily mean everybody is dead too. DG was right to only show what Claire was going through.... BUT the show did a fantastic job of letting us (readers) see what was going on with Jenny (for one). So Claire taking the backlash was understandable. I for one was glad to see that POV
Tracy and Carol -Not much to add, but I did love this episode. I didn’t even mind Jenny’s bitchiness. We book readers know that is Janet Fraser Murray’s personality, and come to expect it. But I do have one thing that, like Young Ian’s age to Tracey, bugs me a bit. Why have the writers done away with the term “Da”? I noticed this in Season 1, when Jenny or Jamie referenced Brian. Joan and Marsali running in, shouting, “Daddy!” I’m sorry, but that seems so off in 18th century Scotland. Just my two cents.Carla
I have been watching your recaps on YouTube since this season started and I love all of them I love Jenny but yes she came off a little to bitchy and poor Claire took it. I just really wanted to say I love this week's recap from you lady's you always make me laugh.
Disappointed with the director(again)For me,last night's show was missing that Outlander Aura.The camera work and the colors were off the show's original and awesome standards. And please, either change Claire's costume or put some dirt on it!
I agree with your suggestion to please change or put dirt on Claire's outfit. She's been wearing the same thing since she returned to the 18th century.
I'm surely in the minority but I just adore screen/TV Jenny in this episode! As Carol said, her actions were passive aggressive and beeyotch-y towards Claire, but I think it's only because she is so full of love and loyalty on the inside and has felt deeply betrayed by Claire not reaching out to her for TWENTY years! Huge props to actress Laura Donnelley. Her eyes and expressions conveyed so much searching underneath her anger. Even through her judgy comments, it looks to me like she really wants to give Claire the benefit of the doubt—like she is just waiting and hoping for the explanation that makes sense and reveals the Claire she knows—but she has great discernment and knows there is more to the story. She is not one to be fooled. I can relate to her in that sense: If my gut was telling me someone I once trusted implicitly was now keeping something major from me, it would be hard to let down my guard. I would probably have a chip on my shoulder until I felt the pretense was uncovered. Plus, with the flashback to Hogmanay and Jenny looking at Jamie with such affection... we can see that all she really wants is her brother to be happy. She was the one to literally catch him during his brokenness and she probably wonders if, since Claire left once, maybe she could do so again. I also love her because she is quite the juxtaposition from Claire's very reserved... Britishness (for lack of a better word). I find her frequent straightforwardness refreshing. I can't remember much about the book Jenny in Voyager, so this is strictly about the TV Jenny's character. However, I get the feeling that if, say, Claire were hurt right in front of her, Jenny would drop all her anger and come rushing to her side to help. Her true feelings of love and concern would take over.Regarding the previews for the next episode, I have to confess... I loved Voyager right up until the point where this episode ended. Beyond that, I started skimming the story because it got way to soap opera-y for my liking. Next week looks like overkill, IMO. The best part of the story is, of course, the relationship between Jamie and Claire. So it's already bothered me how much the show will have them just about to kiss and reconnect then, bam—they are interrupted or distracted. It's like a romantic comedy trope or something. I get that they have a life outside each other, but all these crazy situations they are put in which separate them seem far-fetched. I loved Outlander (book) and season 1. But it took me 9 months(!) to finish Dragonfly in Amber b/c I'm just not interested in all the inner-workings of the politics from back in the day. That said, I was riveted by the ending and I thought the first half of Voyager (book) was outstanding! I loved it even more than Outlander. But (another confession), I only watched the first two episodes of TV season 2 before abandoning it. It just didn't hold my interest. Before season 3 started, I watched the last episode of season 2 to catch up... and here I am, having mostly enjoyed season 3. I'm trying to determine if I should read on after this book.
Barb, I know what you mean about Dragonfly and Voyager. I, too, skimmed a bunch in DIA when it was all the politics, etc. of the Jacobites and the British. I felt guilty, because I love history, but it was boring. Also in Voyager, I got a little disinterested in all the voo-doo mumbo jumbo stuff, but loved the ending. Each book has had sections like that for me, but I will say that starting with Drums and going forward, I have enjoyed them more, and have come upon fewer “boring” sections. In fact, as you follow the stories of these wonderful characters, especially Bree and Roger, and learn more about the science of the stones, even learning there have been othertravelers, you become immersed in this fictional world in the best way. These books transport you to another place and time, you will think about the characters, even worry about them, and look forward to the next chapter or book. Diana Gabaldon definitely delivers that experience, in my opinion. I would advise you to keep on reading. Carla
Dragonfly is hard on a lot of people, and even some huge book fans I know don't care for the middle 2/4th of Voyager. I would totally urge you to keep reading!!
Carla and Steph, thanks for your input. I felt nearly blasphemous to admit what I did on a site like this with dedicated fans. The thing is... what Carla said about being transported to another place and time, and thinking and worrying about the characters... YES! That is what I crave. It's my favorite thing about good storytelling! And I've experienced it in parts so far. But with each book being 800+ pages, it's a big commitment. So yay! I'm hopeful for future reading. Thank you both for weighing in. :)
Barb that is FASCINATING that you skipped Season 2!!! I am PROCESSING! Actually, now that I think about it, I do have some book friends who haven't watched much of the series for one reason or another...one just doesn't want to pay for Starz and hasn't gotten around to watching on Netflix...stuff like that. WOW that is pretty cool that you were able to just pick right back up with Season 3 - and like it! ���� You should definitely keep reading...but go into it knowing this: Book 4/Drums of Autumn is where those who give up usually give up. So know that if you push on...you will get back to that "Outlander" feeling again; I promise you! I loved A Breath of Snow and Ashes for that exact reason! It was just so "Outlandery!" :) Keep us posted!
The question marks were supposed to be a thumbs up emoji. Blogger is being a bit salty today. ;)
Carol, I know what you mean about Drums because that's where I very nearly stopped, too. That book has such a satisfying, happy-ever-after kind of vibe that I was tempted to end my reading when I finished it. However, Jamie and Claire are addictive, so now I'm impatiently waiting for "Bees." With the exception of one particularly infuriating morning-after scene in Echo in the "Boner," I'm glad I soldiered on. BTW, for anyone who may not know, the audio books are excellent (Davina!), and make for great listening during commutes or housework.
Carol and dolittle, Thank you for your thoughts on later books in the series (after Voyager)! Carol, like you say I have heard mixed reviews of later books and I love Outlander (book 1) so much I just can't take more DIA and the like, but if you say "that lovin' feeling" comes back I'll believe you!
Haven't watched the episode yet--but I couldn't miss your take! I think watching you first will help me get past the angst I have when watching--or maybe not!I just want to concur that in the book Jenny is totally full on bitchy when they get home. She knows that with Claire's return Jamie will leave, permanently--she saw the fetch, she has the sight. I think it is also fair to say that she can see no reason for Claire to have not written or contacted them somehow--especially in the books when I believe Claire's alibi was that she went to distant relatives in France. Remember there was that whole thing with the soap--"yeah, yer not family!"Not sure about Carol's thinking Jenny was questioning whether Jamie knew all along that she was alive. In the books, and I thought in the show too, he tells her, "She's gone." That's his "go to" line about her anyway." Did you say in the show he tells Jenny she knew she was alive--that he had sent her to the colonies?! Why would he have married Leery then?! I mean, I know he did know she was back in the future, but that just seems odd and out of character, and I think Jenny would see that too!Speaking of out of charachter I totally agree with Carol that, yes, Jenny is bitchy and we get that, but Jamie would not stand around and smirk at Claire being yelled at! I believe in the books he is down right pissed at Jenny's actions with the whole Marsali showing up episode, like crazed panic pissed!I also have to go back to the whole HOW LONG WERE HE AND LEERY TOGETHER?? I think I may have commented on this on the blog or some other place here when reading your older posts--or maybe for MOBY. No matter how many times I have read through the books, I just don't get the whole, "Da" business with Joan and Marsali. It really seems to me that his living with her was a year, tops! So while the scene with Joan may have been touching, I don't get it, and I am always irritated by the "Da!" when they say it.
I wish that Jenny had walked in and seen the syringe. Now THAT might have told her what was up w/Claire! Perhaps they just didn't have space in the episode to resolve what would have been the fall-out. Wouldn't it be great if the top OL people and DG got together with all the best bloggers (you guys, O.Cast, Kiltlander, Lani, Beth W, Melissa, Karen Henry, Cats, Candida, KaaaanBV etc) and had a big pow wow before they shoot future seasons! (PLEASE GOD we get more seasons!) Maybe at the next Comicon, or maybe somewhere else, say, Scotland??
Hey gals. Thanks for a great recap! This is late, but I wanted to say that I really enjoyed this episode. Maybe I just always need things to slow down whenever we're at Lallybroch, but I enjoyed the pacing, the way the scenes and conversations weren't rushed. Laura Donnelly always plays the hell out of Jenny, bitch or not. I love Wee Ian's surgery scene with Auntie Claire. Best of all, there's Ned!! Yes, I'm still a Ned nut!Because of the show's screw up in S1, there was never going to be a good way to explain away the Laorghaire marriage, but the Hogmanay scene is lovely and almost makes it believable. I even got teary at Jamie's laughter. And I can't tell you how thankful I am that we weren't put through having to witness any scenes of THAT courtship and marriage! And damn, Laorghaire! Did you kiss our Jamie with that mouth?!This is probably the last episode in which I'll feel deeply invested. Once they leave Scotland, my main hope is that they'll keep Claire, Jamie, and their relationship true. Beyond that, I am still looking forward to Turtle Soup. Also, to Maria Doyle Kennedy as Jocasta in S4. I'm hoping she and Murtagh will get along like two rabid badgers. Mostly, I hope we are well entertained...and rarely annoyed. Dolittle
You go Carol!!! love the commentary!! i completely agree with you about Jenny in this episode...!! Jenny needed to show some respect when talking to other Grown Folks!!! she is NOT Jamie or Claire's mother!!